Built from the City's minutes records — no AI-written textBriefing final
The City's record
What the City's record shows
Built only from the City's minutes (215_PZ_Reg_Minutes_12_01_2021.pdf). Page numbers are the minutes' own. Discussion is in the minutes' text; it is not summarised here.
Attendance (the roll call)
Listed present when the roll was taken: Michael Dobrin, Al Washington, Todd Anderson, Jeri Blanco, Marilyn Green, Susan Mock, Russell Sengel, Justin Simpson, Aleck Greenwood, Debbie Joyce
(Checked against the ballots and the printed roll lines; no independent membership list of this board is available to confirm that the roll is complete.)
Listed absent: Jesse Heredia
Also listed as present (staff and other roles): Cindy Thurman (Planning and Zoning Manager), Monica Arsenault (Recording Secretary)
Named on at least one ballot later in the meeting: ANDERSON, BLANCO, DOBRIN, GREEN, GREENWOOD, MOCK, SENGEL, SIMPSON, WASHINGTON (participation, which can differ from the roll: arrivals and departures are in the minutes' text)
Adopted actions (5)
to APPROVE THE DECEMBER 1, 2021 AGENDA (moved by BLANCO, seconded by ANDERSON); PASSED 8-1; ayes: DOBRIN, WASHINGTON, ANDERSON, BLANCO, GREEN, GREENWOOD, SENGEL, SIMPSON; nays: MOCK — the City's minutes, pp. 1–2
to APPROVE THE NOVEMBER 3, 2021 MINUTES AS WRITTEN (moved by BLANCO, seconded by SIMPSON); PASSED 9-0; ayes: DOBRIN, WASHINGTON, ANDERSON, BLANCO, GREEN, GREENWOOD, MOCK, SENGEL, SIMPSON; nays: none — the City's minutes, pp. 1–2
to APPROVE THE DECEMBER 1, 2021 AGENDA (moved by BLANCO, seconded by ANDERSON); PASSED 8-1; ayes: DOBRIN, WASHINGTON, ANDERSON, BLANCO, GREEN, GREENWOOD, SENGEL, SIMPSON; nays: MOCK — the City's minutes, p. 3
to TABLE THE ITEM TO THE FEBRUARY 2, 2022 REGULAR PLANNING AND ZONING MEETING (moved by WASHINGTON, seconded by SIMPSON); PASSED 9-0; ayes: DOBRIN, WASHINGTON, ANDERSON, BLANCO, GREEN, GREENWOOD, MOCK, SENGEL, SIMPSON; nays: none — the City's minutes, p. 4 (the minutes' text and the printed ballot disagree about whether a member voted on this motion)The minutes' text and the printed ballot disagree about whether Greenwood voted on this motion. The minutes' text reads: “Alternate member Greenwood asked if he needed to recuse himself due to his involvement in the hotel project. In response, Board Attorney Eick responded affirmatively.” (from the scanned minutes). The printed ballot lists Greenwood among the ayes: DOBRIN, WASHINGTON, ANDERSON, BLANCO, GREEN, GREENWOOD, MOCK, SENGEL, SIMPSON. This site does not choose between the two. Greenwood's ballot on this motion is not counted as an aye, a nay or a recusal.
to ADJOURN THE REGULAR MEETING OF DECEMBER 1, 2021 (moved by WASHINGTON, seconded by SENGEL); PASSED 9-0; ayes: DOBRIN, WASHINGTON, ANDERSON, BLANCO, GREEN, GREENWOOD, MOCK, SENGEL, SIMPSON; nays: none — the City's minutes, p. 5
Agenda (the City's wording)
No agenda for this meeting was found in the City records this site holds. That does not mean the City published none.
Transcript Partial transcript
Machine transcription of the meeting recording. The words are the recognizer's, except where a passage is marked as corrected or machine re-recognized; most have
not been checked against the audio, so words, numbers and names can be misheard.
It describes what was said. It cannot establish who voted how, an amount or an outcome — the City's
minutes do that (above).
A time links to its passage, and “Copy link” copies that link. No recording can be started from here.
148 suspect passage(s) marked in place; inspection incomplete: language review; 1 stretch(es) where a voice was detected and no words were recognized.
How this transcript was made. New machine transcription of the whole recording, with 8 voices separated from the audio.
7 short machine repair(s) (7 word(s)) are labelled in place, with the original words beside them: an ordinary word was replaced only where two further machine readings agreed on a different one.
Checks run on this transcript: the recognizer's own warning signs and whether a voice was detected where the words are. Not completed: language review.
A second, independent machine reading was compared with it word by word: the same words for 90.8% of 5,923 content words.
Dotted words (162 places) are ordinary wording differences: hover or tap to see the other reading.
148 passages (27% of the words) are marked suspect: their words are not shown ("unclear audio") and support no statement: numbers, amounts, negation or names differ; the language review questioned them; or no voice was detected there.
Agreement between two machine readings is not verification.
Inspection is incomplete: language review.
Voice detected, no words recognized (1 stretch). Something may have been said here that the transcript does not have:
00:35:14 (7 s) — neither reading has words
Speakers were separated by voice. A plain name rests on evidence tied to that voice; “provisional” is a name from an earlier text-only pass and is not verified; “Speaker N” is an unidentified voice.
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Okay. So the item for tonight on your agenda, this is simply the next phase of what has already been worked out in this very large project. And I know for some of you board members, this is a very large protracted project over several years. And this is, once again, not a delay. I want you all to see this as the beginning of ‸ another tree, another branch.
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City Hall site, you know, the details of the development agreement. Now what we have to really do is go, okay, here's the use. We've got to develop it. We're going to look at the site plan. We've got to send it through the formal site plan process with the city. So that's what this ‸ is about.
site plan. In the redevelopment agreement, there was an actual phasing agreement with a timeline, and it said that the large-scale site plan had to be approved in November of 2021.
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professional engineer in Brevard County for over 30 years. We've worked with him for a long, long time, very trusted engineer in the area. We're very excited about working with him.
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looking very good. We just need more time to work on it. So we're here. We've upheld everything that we were upheld. ‸ Staff just needs more time. The engineer on the project is new and needs more time. So as you can see, we have a report in front of you that does reflect what was submitted by the new engineer.
It is accurate. It is a representation of what I do believe are the largest elements of the project. However, many elements that were in the developer's agreement are not there. I do have someone here representing the hotel,
he can tell you about the project. But again, you need to approve the agenda. I don't want to open. You need to decide whether or not you want to open the item for discussion. Only if you're considering the item. If not, please, you need to postpone the item. And I would ask if you go ahead and
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committee meeting, which we're scheduling before Christmas, to meet with the engineer, and to get all the comments rolling. Some of them are quite extensive. We are vacating part of Factory Street to accommodate an in and out for the new hotel. There's a lot of extensive work to be done. And the developer is at the mercy of FP&L. So there are some large utility
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So we feel that there's a lot of time to work some of these things out. We are going to work concurrently with permits, with the developer. So I can assure you from this time frame, when this tree branch grows, this tree branch is going to grow very, very fast.
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I had paid for the first phase for the first group of engineering we had ‸ done, and that was already paid. And we went back for the second tranche of money to be paid in advance for the second part to be done.
resigned left and he had ‸ his own business before we went to Honeycutt his name is Rick Kern and he had his own company before that and he went back left the ‸ company and started his own company over again so I was caught in the lurch of the Honeycutt was too busy to assign somebody else to it so they didn't have somebody to do it so I had to get somebody new to do it and that became a company out of Palm Bay called DFI Construction they hired the present engineer who does in-house work for them and that's how we got to the present engineer Had to get somebody new to, which delayed it, you know, threw it back somewhat and we had to ask for an extension to get the engineering done because we
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my knowledge to my knowledge that's that's that's what I'm not a builder don't get me wrong I'm not you know you can't go to the bank with what I tell you but I'm told by
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morning for two and a half hours the construction company here in town and they're also a partner in a hotel by the way so they're an investor in the hotel as well and they will be building the building and I know that you know the plans were submitted on the 17th 16th or 17th I think
and and so at that time I assumed that they were completed at that point in time that's what I was told according to Cindy I'm not so sure that you know whether they everything has been completed and they have to make some changes from the staff questions or exactly where they are at this particular time I don't have that answer but I do know that they were submitted unscheduled and I don't know anything about the actual condition of them
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yeah That far we should have been open over a year ago for sure. yeah But we had, you know, a lot of delays that were not self inflicted let me put it that way
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project. so you know, we've had to deal with what we had to deal with. Many places that we ‸ have gone to do this project would not take any years long.
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site plan. You are the body that approves the large-scale site plan for the hotel. So tonight, you're looking at a fresh set of the site plan for approval, but it's not really ready for approval because the staff hasn't had time to digest it. So any type of approval that you give it tonight would be conditional. So staff is asking you to postpone it until the February 2nd planning and zoning meeting
county, I mean city sufficiency to make sure that all of the codes and everything are correct and that we have a chance to get closer to make sure that all of the requirements of the plan and the development agreement and everything else that we can get closer to final approval before we bring it back to you for final approval.
agreements that the city and the community redevelopment agency have agreed upon. All of those elements will be included in the plan. It will still meet all of the city council elements that approve. It will not be signed off on or approved unless it meets all of the development agreement elements that the city council and the community redevelopment agency require. ‸ And
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be appropriate to have a condition where it would be subject to administrative approval. At this time, what staff is saying is that they have not had adequate time to review the
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that this really is a separate process. This is just another step and we're actually making process by getting to this step. We hadn't gotten here yet.
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the opinion that I need to recuse myself because my involvement with the hotel in reference to what's being presented to us. I want to be clear if I need to step
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Thank you for hearing me. This is my first planning meeting. So I'm learning, but I am interested. I'm interested in planning and I'm interested in this topic. So I just prepared a statement that I'd like to share with you.
proposal of what's being proposed. And I have a question that this could be timely for what the board will be considering in February. And just from the little I've heard, I do support.
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I have some relevant background in my work experience that it can be very helpful to wait and give the approval at the right moment when everything is correct. ‸ So the, it's a suggestion and a question that I have, and it's in regard to the project and whether or not it will have low impact development features and sustainability features that are incorporated into the project.
on this. And many of our local officials attended that. In that they stress the importance of incorporating low impact development principles into our projects. I currently live in an area.
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I drove by that project and there are currently two trees within the footprint. Two trees were maintained, two in the whole footprint. Now, granted, there was a lot of concrete there, right? Because this is a former commercial property. And at the same time, citizens are looking to understand during the planning phase that something is happening and that the ‸ powers that be, whether it's the developer, whether it's the city, is looking out for the citizens and the community as a whole. Now, I acknowledge that there aren't specific requirements on these. And I did ask the question. So I attended the town hall district for town hall ‸ last month. And the question was asked by a citizen of what sustainability requirements are there in Coco. And
you know, sustainability principles ‸ are incorporated into the project. I clarified, I said, but they're not required, are they? And she said, no. So they are not required. But that request is important to me. So I'm interested in how the city follows up on this requesting process. I'm interested in hearing that the city has on their many numerous things that they have to juggle to make sure all the requirements are met that the questions asked.
And anything that the city subsequently put out there for the benefit of citizens would make people like me feel a little better about new projects because we are currently in a development boom in Coco. That recently released in the October numbers were that my area within about five miles of my
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but new residences. And I'm the one who encouraged Florida today to write an article about that because it's a little undiscovered fact about Coco. And people are getting very aware of this. We had a gentleman who did a drone video of all of this development. So eyes are getting on this. And the more that people that are in your positions who are
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things, who are in the chairs of saying, hey, we're looking at the more that you're asking questions about, well, what are we voluntarily incorporating? Do we have to wait for requirements? Do we have to wait for the council members to have requirements?
What is being voluntarily incorporated? And the builders here, they can put out a statement that would look great in the press. So this is a encouragement and a suggestion that as you proceed with a huge project that's going to get lots of eyes on it, that's going to be the tallest building within how many blocks that you guys
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So I just want to add this encouragement that I well I would love to have more requirements. We can voluntarily ask all the questions we want and any anybody can come forth as a part of the project and say, here's what we're doing regarding
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on this proposed project. Can we put in permeable concrete? Can we put in rain gardens? Can we add curb cuts? Can we do some of the great things that we just heard about at the conference that two members of Coco went to,
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planning. If you want to get it, get in here before you're at the ribbon cutting and the clear cutting. So I appreciate the time on that. You've been very generous with me and thank you for that. I'm welcome and I'll, I'll be watching it and that's all I can say, but I appreciate your attention. I can tell that you're listening to me and I'll be looking for more updates on the project. Thank
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this has been an ongoing working project that has satisfied everything to the point where now we're looking at the site plan. So I just want her to understand that some of her concerns about the meeting that ‸ had that they've had about overbuilding and things like that is taken care of by our code. And we can't do anything different than what the code allows. Now
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I don't have a great deal of knowledge for this lady, but I can can tell you a few things. um First of all, we were given definite you know um descriptions of what had to be done on the site. So this gentleman asked a question, that gentleman to your to your right. uh we
what was originally approved as the first step. And that's why this may seem redundant somewhat, because this is the final conceptual plan. Now, what this lady might be asking about, for instance, um uh the conceptual site plan had all the um diagrams of the building, floor plans, elevations. uh It showed the uh site layout, the where the sidewalks, and all that they're going to be, the pavement, what's going to be grass, and what, as as‸ it's required by the city. uh We paid 25 000 to a professional uh to do the landscaping plan, uh which met the city codes.
by doing uh at least some of, if not all of, maybe, uh the stormwater control on the adjacent site. So, all that had to be done to accommodate the engineering that's now being done on the building to complete what's going to be the infrastructure engineering to handle all the things that I think this lady may be asking about.
So, that is what's being approved right now. What's been approved previously was just conceptually what the project was going to be, the height of the building. That was determined two and a half years ago. The past city manager got that approval done for the height of the building after much consternation. And, um so, I can only tell you that we've done everything that the city has asked and that's what what's presently, uh is being done with the final engineering that will determine the infrastructure, the, the removal of the storm water the sewage, and the water, and all the things that were not in the conceptual site plan. That will determine all that. With this, with what you're looking at now to have approved. And that's, and I don't know what you're talking about about February, but
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what what I want to assure you by asking for this postponement is that when I come back to you in February, you are going to have ‸ a plan that the city staff is confident with that has been reviewed. The engineer is confident. The city staff is confident. The details of the development agreement and
it we not receive the plan the night before um that we're if we're going to go ahead and give the city and everybody the time to go ahead and look this over and do all
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we can go ahead and in our own time look through it and then that gives us plenty of time because you know we only meet once a month and it's always at six o'clock at night and of course there are other people that have day jobs and this time the other but I think that would give the board sufficient time agree for us to at least look over the plan completely and then that way if anybody else has any issues or questions um you know it would it would just be
we're going to give you if we're going to give the city everybody have you know professional time I just ask that they at least give us the required time as well.
Absolutely, I 100 agree and it would be available for any one of you. I would give you any of my time to sit down with you and go over the site plan and the major details of the site plan
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for any one of you electronically or on paper and I will give you any updates and any comments that come from city staff I will gladly share those with you. Either way and again I would happily meet with you and go over those
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on to be the Growth Management Director of the City of Palm Bay. So uh I am soloing it briefly that we have a new senior planner that will be starting with us just after Christmas. And I'm very excited about, it's a he, he'll be starting with us. We just got word this week. He, uh he's a registered land surveyor for the State of Florida, and he brings a lot of experience with the the county.
Brevard County in construction and land surveying and permitting and planning with the county for about 15 ‸ so years. And he's worked with me, and uh we're gonna ‸ hit the ground running. So I'm very excited about that. So um because this body has a lot of responsibility with site plans and uh ‸ rezonings, and we are not going to have the luxury of spacing these things out coming up. You're going to have a lot of meetings coming up that are going to include multiple site plans. It's going to get complicated. So I really appreciate what you said, Justin, about getting things two weeks ahead of time.
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Flag: numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings · 00:39:36–00:39:41 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording
Flag: numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings · 00:39:50–00:39:53 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording
Flag: numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings; the machine readings disagree here; words the first reading may have missed · 00:39:53–00:40:07 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording
our agenda, ‸ allows for open discussion and also any updates for trees situations. Since we are the tree board that I was able to get activated again, since it was ignored for quite a few years. there is
Flag: numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings · 00:40:20–00:40:21 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording
tree that I've been asking Alex about on Harrison street that the commercial property group that I put together got very upset. That was removed and it was done so quickly that nobody knew anything about it. And
the tree board was created was to give reasons why the oak tree needed to be removed before they removed it, uh information of what caused them to make the decision to remove it, and then we usually vote as a board.
Flag: words only one machine reading has (possibly not said); a language review questioned the wording; numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings · 00:41:38–00:41:52 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording
Flag: numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings · 00:41:58–00:41:59 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording
Flag: words were replaced by a machine repair · 00:42:04–00:42:04 · machine repair: words replaced where two further machine readings agreed (not checked by a person)
Flag: a language review questioned the wording; numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings · 00:42:09–00:42:11 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording
Flag: numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings · 00:42:17–00:42:20 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording
Flag: numbers, amounts, negation or names differ between the machine readings; a language review questioned the wording · 00:42:22–00:42:39 · unresolved: the words are not shown (unclear audio); listen to the recording